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Jehovah's Witnesses, If Jehovah does not "Share" His Glory, How could His Son, Jesus, be One with the Father?
And "Share" this glory alongside the Father?
"Father, Glorify Me with the Glory I had before the world was"..........this is telling all of us, that the Word was in a Glorified position alongside the Father, and Shared the glory with the Father.
So, if Jesus is what you say, an angel...and He did not have a pre-human existence, your claims might have some weight....but we all are aware that Jesus Christ, was the "Word", and that Word, became flesh, and resided with men.
Jesus is now Glorified at His Father's side, with the Glory He had before the world was, and in some scriptures it tells us that God alone made the heavens and the earth, in others, everything was was created by Jesus Christ, alone, and still others (Let US make them in OUR image), there were more than two creators.
How can Jehovah's Witnesses make the claim that Jesus was a created being, when there was NOTHING created without His active participation?
Please, try to answer this question with an eye towards proving your point, not pasting 20 scriptures that we all know you are using to bias your answer...please, if you don't know, just say so.
This is the gravest ERROR almost ALL 'christians' are making.It is a horrible twisting of Scripture (the Word),,, made up by antiChrist, Catholics.
Jesus is NOT THE WORD OF GOD.He never taught this.His apostles never taught this.It is not SCRIPTURE.It is grave ERROR.
He was and is not an angel, either.He is and was HUMAN.He is now a glorified MAN in heaven.It was this GLORIFIED MAN, who spoke, speaking of the GLORIFIED FIRST SON OF GOD, ADAM.
Jesus was speaking as MANKIND, here; not as himself, personally.
Adam was not in the DUST of the ground, when he was created.Dust is not the image of god.Adam was the anointed cherub, of Eze 28.
It is this GLORY OF MANKIND of which Jesus pleaded.
Jesus never once said, I am the Word of God.He said, I SPEAK the Word.This is fully proven with all scripture.
Deut 18, God told Moses, I will raise them up aPROPHET, like unto you; (*not like me)... from among their BRETHREN = human.....
and will put my WORD INTO HIS MOUTH....and he shall SPEAK all that I command him.
Jesus verified this by saying,the word I speak is NOT MINE, BUT THE FATHER'S WHO SENT ME.He also said, I speak only what my Father tells me to speak.
God speaks to Jesus, in PROPHESY, in Isa, and said I will not give my GLORY to another...meaning..speaking to Jesus....(not yet existing, but only in prophesy)... I will give my glory only to YOU.
Jesus did NOT CREATED THE UNIVERSE.He is the 'creator' of the NEW HEAVENS AND NEW EARTH, beginning on the Day of Pentecost.
Jesus did NOT LIVE before he was born.No heavenly being left that glory and dropped down into a human woman's womb.
THIS IS HORRIBLE MISUSE OF SCRIPTURE.
I pray you do some serious study into this and ask God to reveal HIS TRUTH TO YOU.
Please, notice that even the JW fell into this TRAP and lie of catholicism, still believing in a false 'pre-incarnate' state.
This word, incarnate, is totally FOREIGN to Scripture, the Word of God.They still had to cling to this lie, as only a FEW PEOPLE, LED TOTALLY OF GOD, WILL COME OUT OF THIS DELUSION, OF A HEAVENLY PERSON COMING DOWN TO EARTH, AS A MAN.
I tell you all, THIS IS LIES OF THE DEVIL.
Not one scripture proves this LIE.
I strongly advise everyone here to start studying the KJV, for this wording is true to all of Gods word.It does not say, ALONGSIDE God.This is misleading.It says WITH YOU.
also, people fail to receive true revelation from god, when trying to discern certain verses; especially that in Phil, which speaks FIRST of the glory Jesus received AFTER HIS RESURRECTION, then goes back to his state here, in the likeness of sinful man.
but notice, it never once says, HE LOWERED HIMSELF; OR HE EMPTIED HIMSELF; OR HE LEFT GLORY OR HEAVEN and dropped into a woman and became a man.
these words ARE NEVER ONCE RECORDED IN ANY SCRIPTURE, so they are made up doctrine, trying to prove this LIE of an incarnate being.
Just read the answers and see how much is stated which is not once in scripture.If God did not say it, it is satan's word.People read scripture, BUT HEAR THE VOICE OF SATAN, whispering his lies to them.
That is the birth of this grave ERROR of an incarnate or pre-existing someone.
Source(s):
KJV truth
These verses explain alot, if Jehovah's Witnesses would only read them with an open heart and with the help of the Holy Spirit. Jesus had the SAME glory as the Father, a glory He willingly gave up and LOWERED Himself to become the sacrifice needed to repair man's relationship with God. The glory that was restored to Him after his death on the cross.
These 3 verses prove everything they believe is false
who spread out the earth by myself
Ecclesiastes 11:5 As you do not know the path of the wind, or how the body is formed in a mother's womb, so you cannot understand the work of God, the Maker of all things.
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Isaiah 44:24 "This is what the LORD says--your Redeemer, who formed you in the womb: I am the LORD, who has made all things, who alone stretched out the heavens, who spread out the earth by myself,
John 1:1-3
"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
The same was in the beginning with God.
All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made."
Notice in Isaiah "BY MYSELF"
Source(s):
Not a JW
Is this the scripture you are using to base your thinking on?
(Isaiah 42:8) 8 “I am Jehovah. That is my name; and to no one else shall I give my own glory, neither my praise to graven images.
or is it this one?
(Isaiah 48:11) 11 For my own sake, for my own sake I shall act, for how could one let oneself be profaned? And to no one else shall I give my own glory.
God was telling the Israelites in statements of judgment that because they had turned to idolatry, and even claimed that they were worshiping Him while bowing to the Baals, he had not given those idols any of his glory or praise.
Jehovah never said that those who are pleasing to him can't share in his Glory.
Here is Jehovah's words to Solomon.
(1 Kings 3:13) 13 And also what you have not requested I will give you, both riches and glory, so that there will not have happened to be any among the kings like you, all your days.
So, Jesus' request isn't something that Jehovah would deny, nor would Jesus have to be "God" to have that glory. In fact, while Jesus only asked to have the glory that he had before coming to the earth, God gave him GREATER glory than he had before. He gave him something that he didn't have before.
The Bible speaks of Jehovah as having immortality and incorruption.
(1Ti 1:17) 17 Now to the King of eternity, incorruptible, invisible, [the] only God, be honor and glory forever and ever. Amen.
He has granted this first to his Son. At the time the apostle Paul wrote to Timothy, Christ was the only one who had been given immortality.
(1Ti 6:16)
16 the one alone having immortality, who dwells in unapproachable light, whom not one of men has seen or can see. To him be honor and might everlasting. Amen.
But it is promised to others, those who become Christ’s spiritual brothers.
(Rom 2:7) 7 everlasting life to those who are seeking glory and honor and incorruptibleness by endurance in work that is good;
(1Cor 15:53,) 54 53 For this which is corruptible must put on incorruption, and this which is mortal must put on immortality. 54 But when [this which is corruptible puts on incorruption and] this which is mortal puts on immortality, then the saying will take place that is written: “Death is swallowed up forever.”
Also, these become partakers of “divine nature”; they share with Christ in his glory.
(2Pe 1:4) 4 Through these things he has freely given us the precious and very grand promises, that through these YOU may become sharers in divine nature, having escaped from the corruption that is in the world through lust.
So Paul spoke of being glorified together with Jesus. Did this mean that him and the other Christians would become "God"? No, but that God would share the glory with them due to their faithfulness.
From the letter to the Romans.
17 If, then, we are children, we are also heirs: heirs indeed of God, but joint heirs with Christ, provided we suffer together that we may also be glorified together.
30 Moreover, those whom he foreordained are the ones he also called; and those whom he called are the ones he also declared to be righteous. Finally those whom he declared righteous are the ones he also glorified.
There are some persons to whom one could talk using all the logical proof in the world and they still would not believe the truth. They love the lie. And if they are not willing to learn the truth, the scripture in 2 Thess.2:9-12 will be fulfilled upon them.It says: "But the lawless one’s presence is according to the operation of Satan with every powerful work and lying signs and portents and with every unrighteous deception for those who are perishing, as a retribution because they did not accept the love of the truth that they might be saved. So that is why God lets an operation of error go to them, that they may get to believing the lie, in order that they all may be judged because they did not believe the truth but took pleasure in unrighteousness."
For his faithfulness Jehovah rewarded Jesus with something that his Son did not have in his prehuman existence—indestructible life in heaven. (Heb. 7:15-17, 28) So his glory is now greater than it was before coming to earth, but it is still not the same as the glory of Jehovah the Almighty God.
Source(s):
Bible
Unlike Catholics, Jehovah Witnesses don't believe on trinity, for them God and Jesus are two different persons and they are "One" just in purpose.
Does Jesus asking to be glorified necessarily mean that Jehovah shared his glory? I can't put the two together.
When Paul speaks of Jesus coming to Earth, at Philippians 2:6,7, he speaks of Jesus as having existed in God's form and emptying himself to come into the likeness of men. He was now a mortal human. Is it possible that Jesus was talking about this glory, the glory of which he emptied himself before coming to Earth? Makes sense to me.
Colossians 1:15, 16 calls Jesus the firstborn of all creation. Can someone be a firstborn of anything without actually being that. I'm my mothers firstborn child...can I say I'm not her child? I sound stupid saying it...
It goes on to say that by means of Jesus, all other things were created.
You could compare it to a company that has machinery for manufacturing...Could someone say Toyota didn't make the Camry, a machine in a Toyota plant did? That'd be a little petty? Sure the machine built it, but i was the company that actually brought it into existence because it supplied what was necessary.
In like manner, God created Jesus and gave him the ability to bring into existence all natural resources and celestial bodies. It makes sense, then, for Jehovah to be credited with creation.
And "Share" this glory alongside the Father?
"Father, Glorify Me with the Glory I had before the world was"..........this is telling all of us, that the Word was in a Glorified position alongside the Father, and Shared the glory with the Father.
So, if Jesus is what you say, an angel...and He did not have a pre-human existence, your claims might have some weight....but we all are aware that Jesus Christ, was the "Word", and that Word, became flesh, and resided with men.
Jesus is now Glorified at His Father's side, with the Glory He had before the world was, and in some scriptures it tells us that God alone made the heavens and the earth, in others, everything was was created by Jesus Christ, alone, and still others (Let US make them in OUR image), there were more than two creators.
How can Jehovah's Witnesses make the claim that Jesus was a created being, when there was NOTHING created without His active participation?
Please, try to answer this question with an eye towards proving your point, not pasting 20 scriptures that we all know you are using to bias your answer...please, if you don't know, just say so.
